Torrified Guitar Tops

nostromo
Posts: 2
Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2019 11:31 pm

Re: Torrified Guitar Tops

Post: # 766Post nostromo
Thu Feb 21, 2019 12:07 am

I picked up an OM2HT with baked sitka three years ago after playing it in the shop and being blown away by the clarity, volume, and over-all responsiveness of feel. The whole guitar seems alive. Now that liveliness is a lot the result of light construction and hide glue, I know, but the openness of the sound, each note deep, round and clear seems more due to the torrification.

OK, do I like it now? I've gone through some changes about it. I have five other Colllings OM or 000 guitars, and for periods I would ignore the baked top OM and rotate through the others. Then, I'd pick it up, play it and ask, what the hell am I doing not playing this monster? It's fantastic!

Where I've settled is this: The torrified top guitar has the classic Collings grand-piano-in-a-guitar sound on steroids for sure, but it lacks the warmth of my other OMs. I've had to find musical styles that show its strengths. For instance, it's loves celtic open tunings like DADGAD or CGCGCD, where the open strings can just sustain and resonate with each other. It's like a waterfall of music.

Of course it's a guitar that you can play anything on and it will sound incredible, but when you're lucky enough to have a quivver of Collings, they all seem to gravitate to their own genres. For instance, my OM2 SS is super sweet and great for Hawaiian Slack Key.

Would I buy another torrified top guitar? probably not. But am I glad to have one, and does it fill a need? yep!

nocaster
Posts: 37
Joined: Fri Dec 28, 2018 3:19 am

Re: Torrified Guitar Tops

Post: # 767Post nocaster
Thu Feb 21, 2019 11:56 pm

I've owned 3 total with torrefied tops. Still have 1 and have another on order. I only sold the previous two to fund guitars with different necks. Unless one could swap tops on the same guitar it would be hard to be sure what the exact effects are so I just accept a guitar as a sum of its parts.

I also don't think a baked top is the same as relic'ing or putting one's own wear on a guitar (would you exclude any old wood before it's bent and shaped into an acoustic?). Although one could argue the relic also affects tone. Sure I can wait 30 years but I might not be alive and I want tone NOW :) Oh and real pre wars are expensive.

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elambo
Moderator
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Re: Torrified Guitar Tops

Post: # 769Post elambo
Fri Feb 22, 2019 2:12 am

I've played torrified guitars and had one which was treated via another process and believe that these are just additional options which will please the ears of some folks and not others. As others have said, guitars are complex devices and no single feature guarantees great tone.

However, my ears bend toward the sound of older, drier guitars and I feel that torrefication assists in obtaining that sound.

There were several great threads about this on the old site -- it's a shame that they're gone.

JohnB
Posts: 77
Joined: Mon Oct 15, 2018 7:18 pm

Re: Torrified Guitar Tops

Post: # 770Post JohnB
Fri Feb 22, 2019 7:51 am

Two of the best guitars I've played have had torrified adirondack tops. One was a Huss and Dalton TD-M with sinker mahogany; the other a Huss & Dalton DS (slope dread) with cocobolo. But it is impossible to separate out the sound of the tops: a non-torrified adirondack Huss & Dalton TD-R was also a great guitar: certainly the equal of the H & D TD-M. Referring to the Huss and Daltons because they seem to have more guitars with torrified tops in the shops. My take is that there really is no separating out the effect of the tops. I will add that one shop owner feels that torrified sitka tops do not benefit nearly as much as adirondack tops and their high ends can sometimes seem muted. And, I would add from my experience with Collings that adirondack tops really do mature into excellent tops in a couple of years of even moderate use.

On the basis of my experience, with three adirondack top guitars, I'm not sure whether or not I'd bother with torrefaction if ordering a custom Collings: with Sitka or German I know I wouldn't.

Georgelange
Posts: 94
Joined: Thu Dec 13, 2018 3:30 am
Real Name: George lange
Location: Ancaster, Canada

Re: Torrified Guitar Tops

Post: # 784Post Georgelange
Mon Feb 25, 2019 12:31 am

Every torrified wood topped guitar I have played has been great sounding and looked good too. I have not bought one yet though

UweKruger
Posts: 1
Joined: Mon Mar 04, 2019 2:22 am

Re: Torrified Guitar Tops

Post: # 822Post UweKruger
Mon Mar 04, 2019 3:16 am

I would like to add to the discussion: I own the prototype D1 Trad.from the NAMM show 3 years ago. It has a torrefied Sitka top and is an awesome guitar, my number one. I also own a D2H Trad. with the same top, equally impressive. I found the torrefication process to be of great advantage for traveling with my guitars, as they seem to be less prone to have the sound board move with the ever changing humidity levels I experience constantly, and this factor alone makes the upcharge worth it. Tone is, of course, a very personal choice, but it seems to me that a baked top amplifies easier. I do own a D1A and a D2HABaaa, both ten years and older, both wonderful guitars. I prefer to travel and perform with my T series guitars. They are the most versatile and responsive Collings' I ever owned. I am awaiting the build of a second D1T, this time with a baked Adirondack top, and I am certain it will be awesome. I also own a Pre-War Guitar Company Model D, and It is an outstanding instrument. It follows that elusive pre war Martin sound a little closer than the D1T, but only a Collings sounds like a Collings. Torrefication is not necessarily just a way to build an old sounding instrument. It is firstly a modern method to build a guitar in the 21st century. My instruments sound great right out of the box, and as I am not a collector but a performer, I am very happy with the opportunities torrefication offers. And I also like the way the tops look, btw...Just my two cents.

Frank Sanns
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Real Name: Frank Sanns
Location: Pittsburgh

Re: Torrified Guitar Tops

Post: # 831Post Frank Sanns
Tue Mar 05, 2019 6:07 pm

As previously stated in this thread many factors affect the way a guitar sounds. A torrified topped guitar will have its own characteristic response and sound when coupled to the other elements of the guitar.

A general statement would be that all torrefied guitars have a particular tone, attack, release, etc. across brands, sizes and materials. This may not sound right but consider how mahogany backed guitars sound relative to a rosewood or maple backed guitars. Similarly a sitka, German, and Adirondack top will have their own unique characteristics no matter what the manufacture or model is.

There are trends that generally hold but are not guaranteed. It is entirely possible, but not highly likely, to have a sitka topped guitar that has more dynamic range and punch than a standard piece of Adirondack. It is not the exception nor is it the rule. It is a generality that holds across a large sample of instruments. Torrefied tops are just that. They have a response and tone that is something other than that of natural sitka, German, Adirondack, etc. It is just one more variation on a theme of guitar woods.

It is important to point out though that this is different than a guitar settling in over time and playing. A torrefied topped guitar will change over its life about the same as the other tone woods. I have the unique position of hearing and playing many of them before and after the AO1 Process and I can say without a doubt that if you enjoy your torrefied guitar when it is new, it will indeed get better with time and playing just like a piece of natural Adirondack or any other natural top woods does.

6l6
Posts: 55
Joined: Wed Oct 17, 2018 5:29 am
Real Name: Bill
Location: San Francisco, CA

Re: Torrified Guitar Tops

Post: # 839Post 6l6
Thu Mar 07, 2019 4:49 pm

Have to say that my ears do not favor baked tops on any of the Collings or Martins I've played that are so-equipped.

Give me basic Sitka or Adi every time.

Bill

* '99 Collings D-1 (my fav)
* '13 Collings D2H
* '14 Collings D2HA
* '97 Martin D-45V
* '69 Martin D-35
* '18 Martin D-42 Custom
* '18 Martin OOO-18GE Custom, Deep body
* '71 Guild F-312NT

Georgelange
Posts: 94
Joined: Thu Dec 13, 2018 3:30 am
Real Name: George lange
Location: Ancaster, Canada

Re: Torrified Guitar Tops

Post: # 856Post Georgelange
Tue Mar 12, 2019 1:35 pm

I’m still not completely impressed with terrified top guitars although I did play a Bourgeois dreadnought with a torridied top and hide glue that sounded pretty good

TStop
Posts: 23
Joined: Tue Apr 23, 2019 12:29 am
Real Name: Tom S
Location: Iowa

Re: Torrified Guitar Tops

Post: # 1077Post TStop
Wed Apr 24, 2019 2:26 am

I've had 15 or more Collings plus some other high-end guitars in the past 25 years. I went to a shop to buy another guitar and this one was head/shoulders above anything they had. I would put my D1 T baked sitka not only over ANY other Collings but gobs of others.

Zero question tone is faster, drier, more responsive and the D1T will play just as hard/ or louder as any D1A without strain or breaking up....(plus it respond to a feather touch another common trait of older vintage guitars) I'm sure its a combination of several things in the T builds and this particular one may be an outlier, but no question the baked top IMO has great deal to do with its uncanny sound.

Adi baked? not so much....but the baked sitka is amazing.

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